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136 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

JC Helary: What's funny is that he could eventually meet the killer of his wife and baby there. And they even might end up staying in jail until the end of their life together. Somebody: Yeah, it's time for the progressive left to put to bed the notion that getting raped in prison is a suitable punishment. Ezra Klein had a great piece about this in the LA Times: "Prison rape occupies a fairly odd space in our culture. It is, all at once, a cherished source of humor, a tacitly accepted form ...

Document Size:	6115
Author:	Somebody Somebody
Date:	Tue Sep 29 18:32:01 PDT 2009

137 [lbo-talk] BHL rallies support for Polanski -- rank: 773

[Jezebel has gotten pretty mediocre since they lost Moe et al, but this is pretty good.] <http://jezebel.com/5370356/letters-from-hollywood-roman-polanskis-rape-of-child-no-big-thing > Letters From Hollywood: Roman Polanski's Rape Of Child No Big Thing By Kate Harding, 3:00 PM on Tue Sep 29 2009, 23,775 views "Does being an 'artist' trump being a rapist?" asks Melissa Silverstein of Women & Hollywood. According to 138 people in the film industry who signed a petition deman ...

Document Size:	13728
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Tue Sep 29 18:29:08 PDT 2009

138 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

On 30 sept. 2009, at 09:03, Doug Henwood wrote: > On Sep 29, 2009, at 7:42 PM, shrill.polemic at gmail.com wrote: > >> I think much of the outrage is over the misconduct of the >> prosecutor and judge during the trial. > > Terrible, of course. But if Polanski did anything like what he's > accused of, he's a depraved SOB. He _was_. If the guy in question were not such a high profile celebrity and considering the fact that the lady has requested to drop the charges, I ...

Document Size:	5401
Author:	JC Helary
Date:	Tue Sep 29 17:57:44 PDT 2009

139 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

On Tue, 29 Sep 2009, Dennis Claxton wrote: > Smoking Gun put the guilty plea up today or yesterday. Grand jury > transcripts with the victim's testimony have been there for a few years > now: > > http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2009/0928091polanskiplea1.html > > http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/polanskicover1.html As you say, the link to the victim's testimony is very nearby: http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2008/0610081polanski1.html Thanks for ins ...

Document Size:	5616
Author:	Michael Pollak
Date:	Tue Sep 29 17:51:28 PDT 2009

140 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

On Sep 29, 2009, at 7:42 PM, shrill.polemic at gmail.com wrote: > I think much of the outrage is over the misconduct of the prosecutor > and judge during the trial. Terrible, of course. But if Polanski did anything like what he's accused of, he's a depraved SOB.

Document Size:	4715
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Tue Sep 29 17:03:20 PDT 2009

141 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

On Sep 29, 2009 5:25pm, Doug Henwood <dhenwood at panix.com> wrote: > I don't get the cultural elite's reaction. So it's not under dispute that > the guy drugged and raped a 13-year-old girl, right? Call me a hardass, > but that sort of thing deserves some serious time. Running off to Paris > for 35 years is hardly a substitute. Am I wrong? > Doug I think much of the outrage is over the misconduct of the prosecutor and judge during the trial. As I recall they basically rene ...

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Author:	shrill.polemic at gmail.com
Date:	Tue Sep 29 16:42:21 PDT 2009

142 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

I think it might be part of confusing a person's talent with their moral worth. If somebody produces a great work of art, then they can't be bad. Otherwise, you would feel guilty for appreciating the work. People do this with Heidegger all the time, but in the other direction (Heidegger did bad things, therefore the products of his talent must be bad). I blame the idea (that starts with, or at least around, Kant as far as I know) that the Genius is some kind of singular individual whose work st ...

Document Size:	6286
Author:	Chris Doss
Date:	Tue Sep 29 16:21:57 PDT 2009

143 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

At 04:03 PM 9/29/2009, Shane Mage wrote: >On Sep 29, 2009, at 6:21 PM, Dennis Claxton sputtered: >> Fuck you. I didn't sputter. I said it very clearly and calmly. I think it's a good standard response to anyone who concludes a 13 year old rape victim was asking for it.

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Author:	Dennis Claxton
Date:	Tue Sep 29 16:11:29 PDT 2009

144 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

On Sep 29, 2009, at 6:21 PM, Dennis Claxton sputtered: > Fuck you.

Document Size:	4434
Author:	Shane Mage
Date:	Tue Sep 29 16:03:54 PDT 2009

145 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

At 03:50 PM 9/29/2009, Shane Mage wrote: >Grand jury testimony is, almost by definition, coached. Ok. Now I know you haven't read it. Coached or no, it's relevant and anyone making proclamations like you are should have read it. >What is *not under dispute* is that Polanski was sandbagged into >a bait-and-switch plea bargain. That is one of things that is very much under dispute. You said earlier both prosecutor and judge changed the terms. Not true. It was the judge only. You don ...

Document Size:	4982
Author:	Dennis Claxton
Date:	Tue Sep 29 15:58:46 PDT 2009

146 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

The cultural elite is going to turn me into Bill O'Reilly before this is all over. Doug ___________________________________ I'd say you have some company. "But it is a firm principle of Socialism never to interfere with personal property in order to investigate its origin or to arrange it in a different way. Never and nowhere! And whoever asserts to the contrary either does not know the principles of Socialism or willingly and knowingly asserts an untruth. The Socialists deem an investigati ...

Document Size:	6481
Author:	Max B. Sawicky
Date:	Tue Sep 29 15:57:57 PDT 2009

147 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

At 03:41 PM 9/29/2009, wrobert at uci.edu wrote: >I had heard that the victim was willing to be >called to be a witness for the defense. I'd be curious if anyone had more >on that. robert wood No. She asked the DA's office to drop it so she could move on. Then and now photos of her are here: http://www.examiner.com/x-264-Celebrity-News-Examiner~y2009m9d27-Roman-Polanski-arrested-in-Switzerland-for-having-sex-with-Samantha-Geimer-31-years-ago-photos http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009 ...

Document Size:	8089
Author:	Dennis Claxton
Date:	Tue Sep 29 15:52:20 PDT 2009

148 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

On Tue, Sep 29, 2009 at 6:25 PM, Doug Henwood <dhenwood at panix.com> wrote: > > On Sep 29, 2009, at 5:31 PM, Dennis Claxton wrote: > > There's nothing so-called about it. Polanski pleaded guilty and the facts >> are hardly in dispute. >> > > I don't get the cultural elite's reaction. So it's not under dispute that > the guy drugged and raped a 13-year-old girl, right? Call me a hardass, but > that sort of thing deserves some serious time. Running off ...

Document Size:	5565
Author:	Matthias Wasser
Date:	Tue Sep 29 15:52:06 PDT 2009

149 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

> On Sep 29, 2009, at 6:10 PM, Shane Mage wrote: >> was *statutory* rape of a sexually mature girl On Sep 29, 2009, Doug Henwood wrote: >> "She was 13, she claims she said no, and he supposedly drugged her... So it's not under dispute that the guy drugged and raped a 13-year-old girl" Grand jury testimony is, almost by definition, coached. It is also, absolutely by definition, unchallengeable by cross examination or presentation of contradictory or exculpatory eviden ...

Document Size:	5419
Author:	Shane Mage
Date:	Tue Sep 29 15:50:09 PDT 2009

150 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

Without disputing what Doug said, I've never understood the solidarity with Polanski thing myself, I had heard that the victim was willing to be called to be a witness for the defense. I'd be curious if anyone had more on that. robert wood > On Sep 29, 2009, at 5:31 PM, Dennis Claxton wrote: > >> There's nothing so-called about it. Polanski pleaded guilty and the >> facts are hardly in dispute. > > I don't get the cultural elite's reaction. So it's not under dispute &g ...

Document Size:	5452
Author:	wrobert at uci.edu
Date:	Tue Sep 29 15:41:54 PDT 2009