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61 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

On Wed, Sep 30, 2009 at 2:02 PM, Doug Henwood <dhenwood at panix.com> wrote: > It's just that when someone says "No no no," you should take your dick out > of her ass. You and your bourgeois 'manners'. I suppose you'll be objecting to shoving a chemical light up a POW's arse next. -- Richard Seymour Writer and blogger Email: leninstombblog at googlemail.com Website: http://www.leninology.blogspot.com Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/leninology Wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/ ...

Document Size:	5462
Author:	Lenin's Tomb
Date:	Wed Sep 30 06:46:12 PDT 2009

62 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

Doug: Did you read her testimony? Of course not. [WS:] "Testimony" and "proven beyond reasonable doubt" are two rather different things, no? A lot of "reasonable doubt" can be raised in this case. You mentioned of cases of your people having sex with priests because they welcomed attention but also having guilt about it. You also must have heard of cases of children testifying what they thought the adults wanted them to say, and that being used as evidence of ch ...

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Author:	Wojtek S
Date:	Wed Sep 30 06:36:01 PDT 2009

63 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

So, if, say, Mike Tyson were to be found guilty of raping a black woman, nothing would happen to him? --- On Wed, 9/30/09, Wojtek S <wsoko52 at gmail.com> wrote: > > I am commenting about what appears to be the law > enforcement apparatus > prosecuting someone for a violation of a sexual taboo > against a Caucasian > female.  I am nearly 100% positive that if the female > were not Caucasian, > there would be no case in this case. 

Document Size:	4996
Author:	Chris Doss
Date:	Wed Sep 30 06:31:21 PDT 2009

64 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

On Sep 30, 2009, at 9:14 AM, Dennis Perrin wrote: > One thing I'll say about this topic -- it served as the centerpiece > to one of the best novels written in English. And one to which the yahoos reacted with even greater hysteria. Shane Mage > This cosmos did none of gods or men make, but it > always was and is and shall be: an everlasting fire, > kindling in measures and going out in measures." > > Herakleitos of Ephesos

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Author:	Shane Mage
Date:	Wed Sep 30 06:30:41 PDT 2009

65 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

On Sep 30, 2009, at 7:17 AM, Doug Henwood wrote: > > On Sep 30, 2009, at 12:43 AM, Shane Mage wrote: > >> Not rape. *Statutory* Rape. Two totally different things. > > Did you read her testimony? Of course not. Having no prurient interest in the matter, and still less hysteria about "drugs," I read only the summary. That was enough. Grand jury testimony is not evidence of anything except what the prosecutor coached the witness to say, as I've pointed out more ...

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Author:	Shane Mage
Date:	Wed Sep 30 06:23:33 PDT 2009

66 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

It depends on the case - the latest case I heard of involves a 17-year old male, old enough to be tried as and adult had he, say, robbed a bank. Other cases involved older males in their 20s or 30s. Also, I am not including cases in which females were very young (under 8 or so) and which did result in successful prosecution. Wojtek On Wed, Sep 30, 2009 at 8:43 AM, Chris Doss <lookoverhere1 at yahoo.com> wrote: > The fathers of these children being how old? > > --- On Wed, 9/30/09 ...

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Author:	Wojtek S
Date:	Wed Sep 30 06:20:52 PDT 2009

67 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

One thing I'll say about this topic -- it served as the centerpiece to one of the best novels written in English. Dennis

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Author:	Dennis Perrin
Date:	Wed Sep 30 06:14:17 PDT 2009

68 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

Matthias: Maybe things are different in your country, but guess what? Your country is wrong. [WS:] Which country is it? As to the rest of your post - I am not commenting on the morality of having sex with adolescent girls, but if you are interested in my opinion on the subject - I think it is unethical, but it also culturally defined, and in some cultures it is ethical or non-objectionable. I am commenting about what appears to be the law enforcement apparatus prosecuting someone for a violation ...

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Author:	Wojtek S
Date:	Wed Sep 30 06:13:14 PDT 2009

69 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

On Sep 30, 2009, at 1:40 AM, Shane Mage wrote: > People are slavering over the "thirteen." Populist puritan > prurience on the left First time ever I've been called a puritan. I'm an enthusiastic friend of all manner of queers and perverts. I hate the classic 70s feminist Dworkinite position on porn. I think the age of consent should be about 14. I think a lot of the priest "rape" cases are a lot more complicated than they're usually presented - that, for example, ...

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Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Wed Sep 30 06:02:54 PDT 2009

70 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

On Wed, Sep 30, 2009 at 8:51 AM, Chris Doss <lookoverhere1 at yahoo.com> wrote: > I'm pretty sure things actually aren't much different in Poland. They > aren't in Russia. Yeah. I certainly make no claims about the actually existing Poland, which I don't know. Just the putative "this country" of Wojtek's post. And of course rape culture is certainly an issue in the US. As the whole reaction the the Polanski thing demonstrates.

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Author:	Matthias Wasser
Date:	Wed Sep 30 05:59:08 PDT 2009

71 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

On Sep 30, 2009, at 8:27 AM, Wojtek S wrote: > I am nonplussed. Many girls sexually mature by the age of 12. It is > not that uncommon in this country to have sex with 12-years olds, and > nobody, including law enforcement, makes any fuss about it. I > personally > know of cases of girls under 14 on parole giving birth and nothing > being > done about it. So basically what this case seems to be about is > prosecution for a violation of a sexual taboo against a white ...

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Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Wed Sep 30 05:55:31 PDT 2009

72 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

I'm pretty sure things actually aren't much different in Poland. They aren't in Russia. --- On Wed, 9/30/09, Matthias Wasser <matthias.wasser at gmail.com> wrote: > > Are you saying that an adult having sex with a pubescent is > no big deal? > Being able to give birth is "sexual maturity" in one sense, > but it doesn't > imply anything like being a morally autonomous individual, > much less a > morally autonomous individual free of coercion. (Being > ei ...

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Author:	Chris Doss
Date:	Wed Sep 30 05:51:27 PDT 2009

73 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

The fathers of these children being how old? --- On Wed, 9/30/09, Wojtek S <wsoko52 at gmail.com> wrote:   I personally > know of cases of  girls under 14 on parole giving > birth and nothing being > done about it.   

Document Size:	4722
Author:	Chris Doss
Date:	Wed Sep 30 05:43:03 PDT 2009

74 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

On Wed, Sep 30, 2009 at 8:27 AM, Wojtek S <wsoko52 at gmail.com> wrote: > Doug: I don't get the cultural elite's reaction. So it's not under dispute > that the guy drugged and raped a 13-year-old girl, right? Call me a > hardass, > but that sort of thing deserves some serious time. Running off to Paris for > 35 years is hardly a substitute. Am I wrong? > > [WS:] I am nonplussed. Many girls sexually mature by the age of 12. It > is > not that uncommon in this c ...

Document Size:	6172
Author:	Matthias Wasser
Date:	Wed Sep 30 05:40:20 PDT 2009

75 [lbo-talk] Polanski -- rank: 773

Doug: I don't get the cultural elite's reaction. So it's not under dispute that the guy drugged and raped a 13-year-old girl, right? Call me a hardass, but that sort of thing deserves some serious time. Running off to Paris for 35 years is hardly a substitute. Am I wrong? [WS:] I am nonplussed. Many girls sexually mature by the age of 12. It is not that uncommon in this country to have sex with 12-years olds, and nobody, including law enforcement, makes any fuss about it. I personally know o ...

Document Size:	6258
Author:	Wojtek S
Date:	Wed Sep 30 05:27:00 PDT 2009