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121 [lbo-talk] Platypus: what we are, what we do, and why -- rank: 773

On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 8:41 PM, Shane Mage <shmage at pipeline.com> wrote: On Apr 9, 2010, at 1:22 PM, Richard Seymour wrote: > inserting not only the Taliban but also Hamas, Hezbollah and the Islamic >> Republic of Iran on top of it all into this narrative of ...

Document Size:	6130
Author:	Joseph Catron
Date:	Fri Apr 9 18:15:33 PDT 2010

122 [lbo-talk] Platypus: what we are, what we do, and why -- rank: 773

On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 7:04 PM, Chuck Grimes <cgrimes at rawbw.com> wrote: > I spent some time on an essay > called, `1968'. It took the Adorno line about the student movements as > fascist and authoritarian. This odd characterization was common back > then. It was the kind of thing ...

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Author:	Bhaskar Sunkara
Date:	Fri Apr 9 18:04:48 PDT 2010

123 [lbo-talk] Platypus: what we are, what we do, and why -- rank: 773

On Apr 9, 2010, at 7:58 PM, James Heartfield wrote: > The decisive factor - and I mean the decisive factor - in > contemporary political life is indeed the defeat of the left. Really, James, who doesn't know that?

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Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Fri Apr 9 18:01:34 PDT 2010

124 [lbo-talk] Platypus: what we are, what we do, and why -- rank: 773

On Apr 9, 2010, at 7:04 PM, Chuck Grimes wrote: > To echo James Heartfield (which I > rarely do) and Doug, just what the fuck does `emancipatory' mean? The Platypuses ask lots of questions, but not that one. Doug

Document Size:	4939
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Fri Apr 9 18:00:31 PDT 2010

125 [lbo-talk] Platypus: what we are, what we do, and why -- rank: 773

On Apr 9, 2010, at 1:22 PM, Richard Seymour wrote: > inserting not only the Taliban but also Hamas, Hezbollah and the > Islamic Republic of Iran on top of it all into this narrative of > "conspiracy". I don't know from "conspiracy," but is anyone prepared to deny that all these ...

Document Size:	5339
Author:	Shane Mage
Date:	Fri Apr 9 17:41:58 PDT 2010

126 [lbo-talk] Platypus: what we are, what we do, and why -- rank: 773

I tend to agree that Tariq Ali is a good man and oughtn't be traduced. But Chris Cutrone is teaching us an important lesson that ought to be heard. The decisive factor - and I mean the decisive factor - in contemporary political life is indeed the defeat of the left. Left ...

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Author:	James Heartfield
Date:	Fri Apr 9 16:58:09 PDT 2010

127 [lbo-talk] Platypus: what we are, what we do, and why -- rank: 773

My history here is hazy, but didn't they join under the assumption that secession was an option?  ----- Original Message ---- From: Doug Henwood <dhenwood at panix.com> There was a process of admission to the union. The Southern states joined freely by ratifying the constitution and signing on the dotted line ...

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Author:	Chris Doss
Date:	Fri Apr 9 15:38:21 PDT 2010

128 [lbo-talk] Platypus: what we are, what we do, and why -- rank: 773

On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 5:30 PM, Bhaskar Sunkara <bhaskar.sunkara at gmail.com>wrote: I was just commenting on the those who were looking at the Civil War through > the same paradigm as the post-World War II period (use of the word > "imperialism" to describe "Northern aggression ...

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Author:	Joseph Catron
Date:	Fri Apr 9 15:08:16 PDT 2010

129 [lbo-talk] Platypus: what we are, what we do, and why -- rank: 773

On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 5:39 PM, Doug Henwood <dhenwood at panix.com> wrote: > There was a process of admission to the union. The Southern states joined > freely by ratifying the constitution and signing on the dotted line. They > even supplied quite a few of our first presidents. (Of ...

Document Size:	5359
Author:	Andy
Date:	Fri Apr 9 14:46:00 PDT 2010

130 [lbo-talk] Platypus: what we are, what we do, and why -- rank: 773

On Apr 9, 2010, at 5:11 PM, Joseph Catron wrote: > You fellows would be more convincing if you would would explain > exactly what > these differences are. Simply alleging "there is a difference" barely > improves on a guessing game. > > Doug, I'm not sure that exempting alleged nation-states from an ...

Document Size:	5797
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Fri Apr 9 14:39:45 PDT 2010

131 [lbo-talk] Platypus: what we are, what we do, and why -- rank: 773

I was just commenting on the those who were looking at the Civil War through the same paradigm as the post-World War II period (use of the word "imperialism" to describe "Northern aggression", etc). I think the Union's triumph and radical reconstruction was the most revolutionary period in American ...

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Author:	Bhaskar Sunkara
Date:	Fri Apr 9 14:30:25 PDT 2010

132 [lbo-talk] Platypus: what we are, what we do, and why -- rank: 773

You fellows would be more convincing if you would would explain exactly what these differences are. Simply alleging "there is a difference" barely improves on a guessing game. Doug, I'm not sure that exempting alleged nation-states from an anti-imperialist line would even put us in opposition to most ...

Document Size:	6326
Author:	Joseph Catron
Date:	Fri Apr 9 14:11:28 PDT 2010

133 [lbo-talk] Platypus: what we are, what we do, and why -- rank: 773

And, as I keep saying, in addition to what Doug mentions there is a difference between 1865 and society reliant on slave-labor and 1945. On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 4:38 PM, Doug Henwood <dhenwood at panix.com> wrote: > > On Apr 9, 2010, at 4:20 PM, Joseph Catron ...

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Author:	Bhaskar Sunkara
Date:	Fri Apr 9 13:57:51 PDT 2010

134 [lbo-talk] Platypus: what we are, what we do, and why -- rank: 773

Doug: > Well, as I keep saying, there's a difference between reintegrating a > portion of one's country that lost a civil war and occupying a foreign > country. That aside, as occupations go, U.S. control of Japan and Germany > wasn't very brutal. Agreed, generally speaking. But when you've ...

Document Size:	5132
Author:	Dennis Perrin
Date:	Fri Apr 9 13:44:02 PDT 2010

135 [lbo-talk] Platypus: what we are, what we do, and why -- rank: 773

On Apr 9, 2010, at 4:20 PM, Joseph Catron wrote: > I find those opposing the occupations (because of all the predictable > anti-imperialist boilerplate) while supporting Reconstruction to be > rather > silly. There may be some intelligent left distinction between the > three > scenarios, but I have yet to see it and ...

Document Size:	5450
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Fri Apr 9 13:38:30 PDT 2010