Search LBO-Talk Archives

841 [lbo-talk] bailout: 'defend private property, at all costs!' -- rank: 1000

John Thornton, will you just listen to what you sound like? 'The financial system needed and continues to need to be stabilized.' No, the financial system is part of the problem, it needs to be abolished. Your yearning for financial stability is a plea to shore up capitalism. When you write 'Letting these banks fail would be incredibly irresponsible.' - that is the point of view of the capitalist class. Working people have no responsibility to saving the banks: this crisis is not one of their ma ...

Document Size:	7102
Author:	James Heartfield
Date:	Tue Oct 7 12:38:09 PDT 2008

842 [lbo-talk] post-script on Mau Mau and Diego Garcia -- rank: 1000

Wojtek The wikipedia page on Mau Mau might be a bit biased, since it largely explains Mau Mau as an outgrowth of Kenyan African Union and the Kikuyu Central Association, underplaying the break with both of those organisations that the uprising actually made - see Frank Furedi, The Mau Mau War in Perspective, James Currey, 1989. I am intrigued that you are writing on the Chagos Islanders. Diego Garcia was a big issue for the left here in the early eighties, which is perhaps why Robin Cook was cag ...

Document Size:	5223
Author:	James Heartfield
Date:	Tue Oct 7 06:22:57 PDT 2008

843 [lbo-talk] Mau-Mauing the Flak-Catchers -- rank: 1000

Wojtek, it wasn't me, but Tom Wolfe who titled his essay, 'Mau-Mauing the flak-catchers'. I cited it aware that Wolfe's argument was a right-wing argument against welfare scroungers, but hoping to show that it was the bankers who were welfare scroungers. It is true that the Kikuyu rebels did not call themselves Mau Mau, but nor it seems did they think of it as an insult. Bildad Kaggia, a leader of the revolt, writes of the Mau Mau movement, (on p 113 of his 1975 memoir, for example). Whether any ...

Document Size:	5216
Author:	James Heartfield
Date:	Tue Oct 7 06:04:24 PDT 2008

844 [lbo-talk] bailout -- rank: 1000

Doug asks: > You want to drive the unemployment rate to 12% or more? No. If I thought the bailout really would draw the poison out of the system, then I would say, support it. But the way it looks from over here is like one of those Irish EU referendums, where the the people have to be dragged kicking and screaming to what the establishment thinks is the "right" vote. A lot of people's first instinct was that it was a crock. Now they are being browbeaten into accepting it. But it lo ...

Document Size:	5206
Author:	James Heartfield
Date:	Tue Oct 7 01:46:12 PDT 2008

845 [lbo-talk] Elves -- rank: 1000

John writes "You use the tools you have. This administration was NOT going to offer a better tool within the time-frame required. If you believe otherwise you may as well believe in elves." I think elves might have constructed a more compelling case for the bailout than you just have.

Document Size:	4696
Author:	James Heartfield
Date:	Mon Oct 6 15:25:28 PDT 2008

846 [lbo-talk] Discussing the Crisis/Bailout -- rank: 1000

John says, Can you point me to a "very good" argument against the bailout? I am tempted to say that I can think of seven hundred billion good arguments But how about it won't work it avoids addressing the underlying problem it rewards the institutions that created the problem it increases moral hazard it is more of the same extension of credit that fuelled the problem in the first place it deepens the US economy's dependence on credit it puts off the problem to tomorrow it damages the ...

Document Size:	5304
Author:	James Heartfield
Date:	Mon Oct 6 12:56:01 PDT 2008

847 [lbo-talk] Revolutionary expropriation of the banks, or credit card fraud? -- rank: 1000

Revolutionary expropriation of the banks, or credit card fraud? http://polaris.moviments.net:8000/i-have-robbed-492000-euros-whom-most-rob-us-order-denounce-them-and-build-some-alternatives-society This Spanish anarchist writes: 'I have "robbed" 492,000 euros to whom most rob us in order to denounce them and build some alternatives for the society. I am writing down this pages to announce that I have expropriated 492,000 euros to 39 banks through 68 loan deals. If we include interest o ...

Document Size:	5549
Author:	James Heartfield
Date:	Mon Oct 6 06:53:23 PDT 2008

848 [lbo-talk] Are the Cities really subsidising Small Town America? -- rank: 1000

When we debated Ms Palin's appeal to small town America, it was argued that the small town was subsidised by the big city. How does the balance stand now that Wall Street is to be subsidised by $700 billion

Document Size:	4863
Author:	James Heartfield
Date:	Mon Oct 6 05:21:21 PDT 2008

849 [lbo-talk] Mau Mauing the Flak-Catchers -- rank: 1000

In his 1971 essay, Mau-Mauing the Flak-Catchers, Tom Wolfe alleges that community groups would scare government into giving them funds by threatening social conflict if they were not supported to prevent it. Isn't that pretty much what Paulson did with the bailout?

Document Size:	4827
Author:	James Heartfield
Date:	Mon Oct 6 05:19:37 PDT 2008

850 [lbo-talk] House rejects bailout -- rank: 1000

Chris takes issue with Dmitri for opposing the bailout, saying it is the minority position. But I don't think I support the bailout, either. I was staggered to see the traders shouting obscenities at their television screens, calling the Congressmen 'idiots' for not paying them seven billion dollars. For 48 hours we were told that if the lawmakers did not sign up to this grotesque bribe that the banks would plunge the US and the world into recession. Then, lo and behold, no sooner was the cheque ...

Document Size:	5453
Author:	James Heartfield
Date:	Mon Oct 6 04:49:16 PDT 2008

851 [lbo-talk] odds -- rank: 1000

> Me, I'll be watching whatever playoff game is on at the time. > > Shane Mage Insomnia kept me up for Obama-McCain (3.30 am in London) - it cured it! I'll wait to read about Palin-Biden in the papers.

Document Size:	4632
Author:	James Heartfield
Date:	Thu Oct 2 12:53:42 PDT 2008

852 [lbo-talk] odds -- rank: 1000

"the republican tactic: to squeeze every last voter out of the base" Didn't the "triangulation" guy (Dick Morris?) tell us the campaign that aims to revitalise its base is going down the toilet?

Document Size:	4532
Author:	James Heartfield
Date:	Thu Oct 2 10:56:37 PDT 2008

853 [lbo-talk] Apologies: once again on productive and unproductive labour -- rank: 1000

whoops again. Sorry about that. post meant for another list

Document Size:	4810
Author:	James Heartfield
Date:	Sat Nov 29 01:33:16 PST 2008

854 [lbo-talk] once again on productive and unproductive labour -- rank: 1000

I am finding it very difficult talking sense to Paula, who seems to find it much easier to argue with what she thinks people have said than what they have said. Paula writes: "Our disagreement is about workers who are employed by capital, at a profit, and who do not produce material goods. And your argument is that all such workers are productive, because it is precisely the social form - the fact that they are employed by capital - that makes them so." But that is exactly what I did n ...

Document Size:	6204
Author:	James Heartfield
Date:	Sat Nov 29 00:55:17 PST 2008

855 [lbo-talk] Apologies: once again on productive and unproductive -- rank: 1000

whoops, sorry again, posting to the wrong list

Document Size:	4792
Author:	James Heartfield
Date:	Thu Nov 27 05:52:18 PST 2008