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23731 [lbo-talk] biz ethics and slavery -- rank: 1000

Charles Brown wrote: >It is the exploiters who would need moral reasons to object to exploitation. Marx himself wasn't really exploited, though he took money from Engels, who got it from exploited labor. So why should Marx have spent his life on a critique of capitalism if not for some moral/ethical reason? Ditto the many Marxist intellectuals of the last 150 years. And I thought that we wanted to get beyond a society based on self-interest. Doug

Document Size:	4953
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Thu Aug 19 09:44:02 PDT 2004

23732 [lbo-talk] truly the Mossad works in mysterious ways -- rank: 1000

New York Daily News - August 19, 2004 I was Cipel's lover... ...and he's still in love with the gov, says prof BY RALPH R. ORTEGA, ALISON GENDAR and NANCY DILLON DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITERS The mystery man who claims to be Golan Cipel's ex-lover said yesterday that not only is the handsome Israeli gay - he's also still in love with Gov. Jim McGreevey. "Golan says he's not gay? He could have fooled me," Dr. David Miller of Livingston, N.J., told the Daily News yesterday, as he claimed that ...

Document Size:	8432
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Thu Aug 19 07:35:12 PDT 2004

23733 [lbo-talk] SBVfT looking wobbly -- rank: 1000

<http://abcnews.go.com/sections/politics/TheNote/TheNote.html> Swift Boat Veterans for Truth: If the Washington Post has FOIAd one of the Swifties, the Post has probably FOIAd many of them . . . so this is just the tip of the proverbial spear. Michael Dobbs: "In newspaper interviews and a best-selling book, Larry Thurlow, who commanded a Navy Swift boat alongside Kerry in Vietnam, has strongly disputed Kerry's claim that the Massachusetts Democrat's boat came under fire during a missi ...

Document Size:	7539
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Thu Aug 19 07:32:28 PDT 2004

23734 [lbo-talk] Bushisms, again -- rank: 1000

Washington Post - August 17, 2004 Reprising a War With Words By Dana Milbank Earlier this month, President Bush was almost done with a speech to a group of minority journalists when he dropped a rather startling proposal. "We actually misnamed the war on terror," he said. "It ought to be the Struggle Against Ideological Extremists Who Do Not Believe in Free Societies Who Happen to Use Terror as a Weapon to Try to Shake the Conscience of the Free World." Or, if you prefer to a ...

Document Size:	9350
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Thu Aug 19 07:13:04 PDT 2004

23735 [lbo-talk] KPFA Staff Open Letter to the Local Station Board -- rank: 1000

Joseph Wanzala wrote: >Actually, it is very hard *not* to take sides, and even if you do >not do so consciously, you do so by default by dint of positions >that you take. You have certainly taken sides by saying that you are >iwth Sasha on this, while acknowledging that you have not studied >the situation closely and without having even read the other staff >letter. > >Clearly Pacifica has been lurching from one crisis to the next for >years. I have been intimately inv ...

Document Size:	9758
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Wed Aug 18 16:32:47 PDT 2004

23736 [lbo-talk] A Free (and Christian) South Carolina? -- rank: 1000

DeborahSRogers wrote: >Cory Burnell (search), Christian Exodus' founder and president, told >FOX News that the group narrowed its focus to the Bible Belt state >based on an electorate that is already "Christian-leaning," has its >own ports and ó unlike its neighbor North Carolina ó is no hub of >liberalism. Saw this guy on Fox the other day. When asked whom he planned to vote for in November, he said the Constitution Party candidate, "because there are no significan ...

Document Size:	5336
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Wed Aug 18 16:19:08 PDT 2004

23737 [lbo-talk] Groups, How defined was Democracy &. . .Rights -- rank: 1000

Carrol Cox wrote: >And does "Black Community" name a real group? We've argued that question >several times on this list. > >Males-with-brown-hair-weighing-between-150-and-220-pounds is not a >group. Are white males a group? Is the "working class" a group? The bourgeoisie? Doug

Document Size:	5094
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Wed Aug 18 15:38:56 PDT 2004

23738 [lbo-talk] re: biz ethics and slavery -- rank: 1000

joanna bujes wrote: >Carrol Cox wrote: > >>I do think it wrong to call capitalism immoral, for reasons analogous to >>the reasons Miles has been giving on the other issue. Morality is >>history-bound, not transcendent. Hence the charge that capitalism is >>immoral or unethical is a claim that the judge is outside history, but >>that is the implicit claim in all capitalist ideology. >> >> >NO. Placing the right to private property over the right ...

Document Size:	5502
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Wed Aug 18 15:12:27 PDT 2004

23739 [lbo-talk] posting -- rank: 1000

Follow this link only if you have a richly developed taste for dish & sleaze: <http://scandalmonger.net.hosting.domaindirect.com/creation.htm>.

Document Size:	4616
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Wed Aug 18 13:26:33 PDT 2004

23740 [lbo-talk] Left/Venezuela -- rank: 1000

Shane Mage wrote: >"breaking with the Dems," for the revolutionary left, is neither >a long-term strategy nor even part of a long-term strategy. It >is the condition sine qua non for the possibility of a long-term >strategy. It's a reflex, not a strategy. Trots have been saying it for decades, as they splinter further into deeper irrelevance, and now the Greens have taken it up, as they too splinter further into deeper irrelevance. It's a fine impulse if there are steps 2 ...

Document Size:	5080
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Wed Aug 18 11:45:50 PDT 2004

23741 [lbo-talk] Counterpunch: McGreevey undone by the Mossad! -- rank: 1000

Joseph Wanzala wrote: >you mean the Israelis? No, Counterpunch, but you knew I meant that. Don't you think there's something weird about blaming Israel for everything? Doug

Document Size:	4894
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Wed Aug 18 11:39:19 PDT 2004

23742 [lbo-talk] usage question -- rank: 1000

Seth Ackerman wrote: >i've heard it. i've always thought of it as a jersey expression. Wow, guess I've been away from Jersey too long. Or too old to be up with the latest argot. I only just learned of it the other day - Gakwer referring to Pam Anderson <http://www.gawker.com/topic/nyt-joyce-wadler-healthy-obsessed-with-pam-andersons-funbags-019211.php>. Doug

Document Size:	4898
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Wed Aug 18 07:43:33 PDT 2004

23743 [lbo-talk] Left/Venezuela -- rank: 1000

Yoshie Furuhashi wrote: >Besides, what's the point of "theory" if you are using it, like >David Harvey, only to construct an elaborate rationalization for >campaigning for the Democratic Party? So just because Harvey emerges with a conclusion you don't like, his theorizing - and maybe theorizing in general - is a waste of time? I'm stunned. You've become a total activismist. The assimilative powers of American ideology, even in its alternative varieties, are truly immense. Har ...

Document Size:	5451
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Wed Aug 18 07:36:20 PDT 2004

23744 [lbo-talk] Counterpunch: McGreevey undone by the Mossad! -- rank: 1000

[they've gone completely around the bend] <http://www.counterpunch.org/madsen08142004.html> Weekend Edition August 14 / 15, 2004 An Israeli / Rove Connection? The McGreevey Scandal By WAYNE MADSEN Here we go again. Another political bombshell hits the American people and there is yet another connection to the subterranean labyrinth of possible Israeli intelligence activities. New Jersey Democratic Governor Jim McGreevey's announcement on August 12 that he was resigning because of his invol ...

Document Size:	6875
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Wed Aug 18 07:27:32 PDT 2004

23745 Alinsky Re: [lbo-talk] productivity -- rank: 1000

Carrol Cox wrote: >For what it's worth, the Back-of-the-Yards organization in Chicago, the >archetypal Alinsky achievement, developed into an aggressively racist >organization [...] >The Chinese had a slogan, Serve the People, that perhaps catches up part >of what Kelley seems to be after. For what it's worth, the Mao's China turned into a great capitalist success story. I've never heard you explain what happened, Carrol. Doug

Document Size:	5082
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Wed Aug 18 07:21:42 PDT 2004