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1066 [lbo-talk] Jacobin debate up -- rank: 1000

On Oct 20, 2011, at 2:11 PM, Bhaskar Sunkara wrote: > What the video might not have shown is that Doug and company's arguments > were received *much *better by the audience and like I said before, I'm > pretty sure free CUNY will have wider resonance in the general public > than pioneering new and creative ways to fuck. I resent the implication that I'm not interested in new and creative approaches to fucking, or that I'm a stranger to them. Doug

Document Size:	4952
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Thu Oct 20 11:28:04 PDT 2011

1067 [lbo-talk] OWS Demands working group: jobs for all! -- rank: 1000

On Oct 20, 2011, at 1:10 PM, Bhaskar Sunkara wrote: > Matters aren't > helped by the efforts of some, like ThinkProgress or the Roosevelt > Institute, to actually turn OWS into a Democratic electoral vehicle. That's true of ThinkProgress, and the Van Jones-MoveOn combine, but I don't think that's fair to the Roosevelt Institute, at least the person of Mike Konczal. Doug

Document Size:	5091
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Thu Oct 20 11:19:13 PDT 2011

1068 [lbo-talk] OWS Demands working group: jobs for all! -- rank: 1000

A comment just posted to my blog, which is very much like one posted half an hour ago: > yes, i'm sure capitalists will be terrified by your generous offer to work more for them. Therefore, jobs programs are bad. So here we have a random poster and a high-profile intellectual telling us why such demands are bad from an anarchist POV. Doug

Document Size:	5031
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Thu Oct 20 11:16:25 PDT 2011

1069 [lbo-talk] OWS Demands working group: jobs for all! -- rank: 1000

Here's a statement of the principle, by a very sophisticated guy (emphasis mine): <http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2011/10/david-graeber-on-playing-by-the-rules- -the-strange-success-of-occupy-wall-street.html> This is where I must admit my own position is particularly confusing. On the one hand, this is exactly the kind of attitude I have been arguing for for years. I like to describe myself precisely as a small-a anarchist. That is, I believe in anarchist principles mutual aid, direct a ...

Document Size:	7810
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Thu Oct 20 11:14:47 PDT 2011

1070 [lbo-talk] OWS Demands working group: jobs for all! -- rank: 1000

On Oct 20, 2011, at 1:32 PM, leninstombblog at googlemail.com wrote: > I think the demand for a public works programme funded by redistributive taxation is an intelligent one to pose, and will help fundamentally shift the political and cultural representations of tax in the US Yay. Thank you. I was beginning to feel my mind slipping away...

Document Size:	5097
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Thu Oct 20 10:34:24 PDT 2011

1071 [lbo-talk] OWS Demands working group: jobs for all! -- rank: 1000

On Oct 20, 2011, at 12:34 PM, Ferenc Molnar wrote: > DH: "That's not an ad hominem. It's part of the analysis. E.g.: anarchists object to demands for a public works jobs program financed by taxing the rich because to do so would be to legitimize the state and reinforce the commodity-money setup. (I'm not making this up - it's happening in the demands working group of OWS right now. See next message.)" > > FM: Actually, it kind of is ad hominem. You're making the choice to char ...

Document Size:	5774
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Thu Oct 20 10:05:25 PDT 2011

1072 [lbo-talk] OWS Demands working group: jobs for all! -- rank: 1000

[As I just said, the anarchist-libertarian faction is trying to block the adoption of this by the OWS general assembly.] TEACH-IN: DEMANDS WORKING GROUP PANEL Saturday 3:00-5:00 PM 66 W 12th St Rm 407 Part of Day-long Teach-in sponsored by the New School Senate What s the story about the proposed Jobs for All Demand? The Demands Working Group of Occupy Wall Street unanimously endorsed and is circulating for discussion the following demand, which will be submitted to the General Assembly of OWS: ...

Document Size:	6798
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Thu Oct 20 06:33:29 PDT 2011

1073 [lbo-talk] Jacobin debate up -- rank: 1000

On Oct 20, 2011, at 9:17 AM, Eric Beck wrote: > On Wed, Oct 19, 2011 at 8:06 PM, Doug Henwood <dhenwood at panix.com> wrote: > >> I just don't buy it. I don't think that we can get anywhere without changing the state. But purity demands that we not do that because it would step on the prefiguration. > > See, I'm always interested in these first two sentences, but they are > always followed by the ad hominem third sentence. I've always wanted > to hear more about the ...

Document Size:	5947
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Thu Oct 20 06:30:09 PDT 2011

1074 [lbo-talk] Jacobin debate up -- rank: 1000

On Oct 20, 2011, at 8:55 AM, Wojtek S wrote: > Is there a written summary of it somewhere. I'd rather read it than > watch a nearly 2 hour video. Are you kidding? Who's going to write up a summary of it? Doug

Document Size:	4683
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Thu Oct 20 06:07:12 PDT 2011

1075 [lbo-talk] Jacobin debate up -- rank: 1000

On Oct 20, 2011, at 6:12 AM, James Leveque wrote, amidst some fine comments: > And I think Doug alluded to this in his comments about Spain - if you're not > holding the space, then the movement fizzles. So does anyone know what's going on in Spain? My instant research before the event said it fizzled. Some people in the audience said no, but were unconvincing on the details. Anyone know? Doug

Document Size:	4870
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Thu Oct 20 05:12:55 PDT 2011

1076 [lbo-talk] Jacobin debate up -- rank: 1000

On Oct 20, 2011, at 4:08 AM, SA wrote: > I saw it out of the corner of my eye and was so deeply impressed with the left-handedness that when I performed a reenactment for a friend later I made sure to do it with my left hand. How I love being an influence. Doug

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Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Thu Oct 20 05:11:17 PDT 2011

1077 [lbo-talk] Jacobin debate up -- rank: 1000

On Oct 20, 2011, at 3:01 AM, Dennis Claxton wrote: > So you're left-handed? Ha, yes.

Document Size:	4540
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Thu Oct 20 05:10:02 PDT 2011

1078 [lbo-talk] Jacobin debate up -- rank: 1000

On Oct 20, 2011, at 1:36 AM, Mike Beggs wrote: >> Regardless, Natasha's is a thoroughly materialist vision of social >> change as political practice. Ideas change in the process of putting >> your ass on the line trying to change the society you live in. The >> idealism problem rests with the rest of the folks in the room, >> unfortunately. > > See, I just don't think this version of 'materialism' is useful - the > idea that there is some social domain that ...

Document Size:	5709
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Thu Oct 20 05:09:50 PDT 2011

1079 [lbo-talk] Jacobin debate up -- rank: 1000

On Oct 19, 2011, at 9:33 PM, Ferenc Molnar wrote: > Regarding the question put "to anarchists" at the panel concerning how a tactic turns into revolution, I'd research the writings on "Dual Power" or better yet invite people like Wayne Price, who stood up in the Q&A session and who have spent their lives working in relative obscurity on the questions being asked, to future panel discussions. Could you say more? Doug

Document Size:	4903
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Wed Oct 19 18:46:24 PDT 2011

1080 [lbo-talk] OWS: a view from Australia -- rank: 1000

[posted by Gary MacLennan to Lou Proyect's Marxmail] Watching this and it was extremely interesting to sit through. This is I truly hope the very beginning of the reconstruction and the rediscovery of an American Left. I keep banging on about this, but American comrades must understand how this is galvanising the world. If the Left in America re-emerges as an historical agent, then a lot will become possible. The actual viewing of the video was in many ways a trip down memory lane for me. It has ...

Document Size:	5693
Author:	Doug Henwood
Date:	Wed Oct 19 18:14:24 PDT 2011